How to Build Healthcare Tech That Earns Trust

Speaker 1: Welcome to She Built It. I'm your host, Melanie Bar. Maheen, thank you so much for being here.

Speaker 2: Thank you. Thank you for inviting me.

Speaker 1: You are a Stamford neuroscientist who chose to build a company. What made you decide that building not just research is the best way to create change?

Speaker 2: I think as researchers and as scientists when we are going through our training, we are told that you know, publish or die, publish or perish. I think that's the thing. And we're so focused on trying to publish whatever we find in these really amazing journals that only have reach to the academia and to the community. So there's no pushing it forward to the lay people or to the community. However, in the last 10 years or more, I've noticed that there's way more interest in science, especially brain health, and a lot of everyday publications that we read online, especially reals, are very focused on what we find. So, we do get into it now. We do have YouTube videos and stuff that do get into our research, but there still is not hands on immediate impact in the community. So if I'm working on something that I can actually put in the hands of the patient really fast in a very commercial way, I feel like I've really served my purpose for science because science should work for everybody. It has it really is completely agnostic to anything other than the human body, the science that we work on. So yeah, I think creating a company that can actually provide a solution in the hands of the patient and the caregiver and the provider immediately that they can download and use. I mean that's impact. You're right

Speaker 1: and reels are so fast. They're quick moments in time and maybe we need a little bit more than that. Share with us more about who you are, what you've built with Seuss Solutions and the problem you're solving. I am always like

Speaker 2: to say I'm originally from Pakistan and I came here you know when I was 19 and I have uh gone through all of the my academic route with different universities getting my PhD uh and my master's and bachelors and all that and I did my posttock at Stanford after my PhD in neuroscience and I kind of stayed there because I got involved with uh veterans affairs PaloAlto and I've been in those dual positions um for about 20 years now. So I'm currently directing a woman's health centers research and also a clinical professor in neurosurgery at Stanford. And my background is neuroscience, meaning I'm a PhD, not an MD, but I've always studied the brain and always found it absolutely fascinating because it's the only organ in the body that can literally change the way you dream if you stimulate it. And I think uh just fascinated by it and always looking to study it. So I got I I've been studying eye movements and traumatic brain injury and Alzheimer's with neuroiming and all that for 20 years. And about three years ago, I was doing a faculty fellowship at the biioesign school at Stanford. And Stanford really encourages innovation

Speaker 1: and ideas that doctors have that they can take it to market so that again you can have a bigger impact than to the patient and the provider and and caregivers. So I came up with this idea of creating a solution for communication for people who cannot speak. Giving voice to the voiceless is how you would say it. And it is interesting because it was something it was something that happened with my father in 2007. He had a stroke and he had a fasia right afterwards and within 3 days he was diagnosed with depression. He could not communicate at all and it took him 15 minutes to ask for a glass of water and it was devastating for the whole family. But now that I'm doing this, I know that it was more devastating to me from the perspective of I had just finished my PhD in neuroscience and I really thought I understood the brain and I couldn't help my father and it really did affect me in a very grieving way but at the same time I wanted to do something about it but obviously I couldn't. And when they asked me for an idea to create a company, I wanted to have something that could be immediately offuse. And I didn't want to create a device. I didn't want to go through the FDA route. I wanted something that people could use. So I used an iPad, the camera and the iPad. And I you I uh worked with a company to create a solution with a with the programming the AI enabled so that we can use the eye tracking to measure eye movements as well as head movements and use them so that you can capture things from the screen of an iPad by a patient and they can throw it from the iPad to the caregiver's phone. And that way if you needed a glass of water or anything, we don't have like a stimulus library. We have whatever you want. So I can put um my daughter's picture on the screen and my eyes will pick it up and take that picture and give it to the caregiver saying I want to see my daughter and it measures your eye movements and your head movements and then we can gather some personal health data in terms of like how good your movements are and that could be a a detection of some sort like in terms of your eye health and everything is very need-based. So we decided that we would be able to actually capture how involved the caregiver is which is really making this application not just very patient oriented but actually very businessoriented. This is B2B marketing. So we can actually target nursing homes and rehab hospitals because they're always looking to provide better care for their patients. And if you can measure what the caregiver is able to do during the day, how many needs can be measured that they're meeting, that's a really good thing. It's a needsbased score. It's a needs assessment. So that's really what we're doing. That's

Speaker 2: so interesting. I mean, a lot of listeners probably don't know this, but I'm also in the senior housing industry. And so to think about that type of support, to be able to help your father in that way has to be so incredible for

Speaker 1: you. The interesting part about this is that when you when you do have a a stroke and you have aphasia afterwards and you're you're a caregiver and you're I was the the daughter at that time and it really affects you and you're personalizing your story and you're talking to your family, you're talking to your friends, but you're kind of like just within yourself, right? But then after years of grieving about it and when the right time came, I don't do particularly stroke research. I'm not a a a stroke neurologist or anything like that. I'm a neuroscientist. I know how it works, but I kind of stayed away from it because it was traumatic for me. And then you get to the point where you actually look at the epidemiology of it. And you figure out how many people actually have gone through this. How many people are there that have a stroke and cannot talk? Every year, close to 175,000 people in the United States have stroke with aphasia. New ones. Not talking about the ones who are going through rehab. There's ALS, there's MS, there's neurodedevelopmental disorders, there's kids who cannot speak between the ages of five to 17 or they when they they they should be speaking between 5 to 17. They need all these special eds. And I think it's really important to understand and that's one of the things that I learned in my classes that were nonclinical and non-ressearch is the business side of things. what is the need? So, it wasn't just my dad. The need was much bigger and that's what I want to address is like take it to market because there's people like my father and there's people like me and my mother who would or my brothers who the whole family just devastated into because communication is is a human right and hundreds of and hundreds of thousands of people that you

Speaker 2: could be helping. tell us more about the

Speaker 1: business process and the data behind it and how you're able to use that data. So we have about So let's let's go back to some basics on this. So our all three of our apps are on Apple App Store right now. So they're on a premium so you can download them. Our programmer will be contacted and you will be able to use the basic package without any fee and we will charge in a little bit but right now we're letting people use it. We are FDA approved to be used as a communication solution. We are also backed by Stanford. So we are ready to sell. Uh we are also reaching out to our bigger communities uh nursing homes and so we have about three pilots that are going on. So we're trying to collect data in three different institutes. One of them is children pediatrics department at Aakhan University in Pakistan because I'm a visiting professor there. It's an IRB approved project. So, we're trying to do it in in children there, have children use it. We are also starting a pilot in Kansas City and it's St. Luke's Hospital. It's their big um and we are working on an IRB proposal there. They've said yes. They've given us a wonderful letter and we are starting a study there. We also have a study that we are working on with Berlingame Senior Care. So you can see I'm attacking both ends of the spectrum, neurodedevelopmental and elderly care. This kind of work has huge impact in terms of lots of different ways we can use it. But as long as we use it for communication right now that would be the best way to go. It is a software a basically digital health. It is a SAS model. So we get the basic package and then after that you get uh you can keep adding things to it. As we gathered the data, the data the for B2B the main data is needs assessment score which is about how many times does the caregiver actually go and meet the needs of the patient give them what they need and once that is done then you basically are able to show that not to just your business partners in the community and say hey you know we've got this innovative way of in our nursing home that we can actually measure how caregivers are doing but you can also give it to your insurance companies and say look this is like an important thing. Right now, we don't have insurance to pay for it, but as we gather the data, we should be able to convince the the insurance to pay for it because we will be able to provide the quality of life both to the caregiver and the patient and we will have better needs met. In fact, one of our nursing homes was like, we would like to put this in our flyer because we're so digitally, you know, AI oriented. And so, so that's where we're at. And I think the the actual solution the communication solution actually grows with you. So like I said you can add your own pictures in it. You can use your fingers to touch if your hands are working. Most sometimes when stroke happens most of the time your if it's left hemisphere stroke your right hand doesn't work which is why I used eyes. So if your eyes cannot pick it up or your eyes your hands your hands are working you can use your um fingers but it still tracks your eyes and your head movements. That's our model right now. We are selling we would like to sell it directly to patients with a price if they want but our main strategy right now is B2B and it'll be like a certain amount of money for like 12 licenses for each facility.

Speaker 2: And if someone wanted to go to your apps

Speaker 1: what what are they? So they're called SOF solutions and there's three apps. One is for patient which works on the iPad and two are for iPhones uh for provider and caregiver. We're also working on moving it to Android which is um really important for use in like bigger uh in like other other countries that are not as well off and don't have Apple as much. You can download it and it's it's available on Apple right now. And the good thing about it is is that it's quite easy to use. We have an AI chat box in in it. We also have a programmer who is able to answer all kinds of questions and it's easy to use. That is something that we we are very proud of because a lot of the devices and a lot of apps that are out there for people who cannot speak takes a long time for them to learn. They're also very expensive. A lot of them are their own devices with amazing eye trackers, but that means you just have to carry another device with you. There's also no communication with the caregiver a lot of the times. So there's there's more of I don't like to say that oh I'm using AI because AI is just like a buzzword. I'm using AI because I'm bringing humans together because everything you do every day is you and the phone. There's but I like to say that our SU solutions brings people together. That's what the logo is. It's three people holding hands. There's no AI in it. three people are holding hands because AI brings them together and it doesn't do anything despite any anything like that

Speaker 2: and you're helping the patients because you're helping people to be able to speak but then you're also bringing in that data which is really interesting because I've never heard of anything like that being being tracked or the ability to be evaluated because everyone wants the best care.

Speaker 1: Exactly. Now, preventive care, best care to be able to. So, I don't say diagnose. I say detect and detect, which is complimentary to whatever the doctor's doing, whatever the ER is doing, whatever I I'm not going to say, hey, I detected. I'm going to say it's going to either make it quicker or it's going to create a warning sign that's going to help lead to better better solutions, better outcomes, better quality of life. Now, it is it is so cool for us to think about the eye. The eyes are amazing. The eyes are I mean I love eyes not just because of makeup but I I I love makeup but it's important to know it's a beautiful feature of your face and if you look at any poetry from at least you know in my language or in other languages eyes are always talked about because it's how you know the entrance to your soul or whatever eyes are part of your brain and a lot of marketing strategies a lot of um personality a lot of leadership classes are about how you look at other people like how what your eyes are saying because eyes are part of your brain. So I know that eye tracking has been studied for years in neuroscience and I've been advising companies. I've published papers in it and I think it's an amazing thing to look at the back of the eye to look at multiple scerosis to look at the back of the eye for amaloid for Alzheimer's and other movements for how it moves uh the for traumatic brain injury. But it can also be used as a way to communicate without speaking. You know, like you would say her eyes told the story, you know, all that stuff. Like there is a way to actually gather the XYZ coordinates of your eye to actually have an eye health score that can you can see changes happen in every day based on your body, based what your brain is feeling. And maybe that's a way to detect changes in the body.

Speaker 2: That's so interesting because the eyes

Speaker 1: do say a lot. They do. Yeah, they do. And um and I know you take it a step further

Speaker 2: from what we see visually. Exactly.

Speaker 1: You know, when you were talking about the back of the eye and how it relates to neuroscience, it's so interesting.

Speaker 2: It is. And of course, I'm a mom, so when my daughter and my son do something, I'm just like, they always, do they know the neuroscience behind that? It's called mom's neuroscience.

Speaker 1: Exactly.

Speaker 2: I also think about how um how we think and how that approaches business, you know, how we can wire our brains to think in a certain way in business situations and to grow our business and to have a growth mindset, right? I I think we just have to you know empathy is a really new thing in the business world like compared to like how it used to be in the 80s and 90s you know and even in 2000 empathy is something that is really important for today's leadership and it comes from really reading the room and re understanding the other person and I'm old enough to like curb my anger I won't say enthusiasm because I like to be enthusiastic I love to show how excited I am about science, about the work that I'm doing or about anything really. I get excited about, you know, customized tailoring. So, you know, it's it's important to show the excitement and the opportunities that are out there, but when it's negativity or when it's like your eyes can really really tell and and so, you know, I I don't have a poker face, but that's one of the things that people who who are very good at dealing with business, their eyes can they can mask movements of their eyes in a way that is in people can understand that.

Speaker 1: That's interesting. It's interesting when you think about working through negativity in certain situations and it's I I haven't ever thought about how eye movement correlates to that.

Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a lot of there's a lot of data out there about eye movement correlating with mood, depression, attention deficit disorders, focus. there's some some uh relationship to particular genetic variants that we have that make us more proverate more that may give us tunnel vision you know stuff like this there's I mean there's just once once we get going on this in terms of gathering the data the things that you can do is it's amazing

Speaker 1: it's so interesting I have large eyes and I've always been asked especially when I was younger if I was scared I'm like no I'm not scared I just have just have round eyes. But I do see how the data and in relating to places like senior housing or nursing homes and how valuable that that data can be as it relates to healthcare as well. I visited I think I said this in another um interview that I was given. The first time I visited a nursing home I think I was 20 years old and it was in the US and I had been at 21 years old. I'd been here for 2 years and it was very shocking to me cuz in my culture there's no such thing as nursing homes. It's not necessarily a good thing. A lot of people are not able to take care of their parents. They don't have the income to do it and there's a lot of bad things that can happen. So there's good and bad on both sides. It's just I'd not seen a nursing home before and it was actually a very nice nursing home in Selenus and but it really affected me. It's interesting to think about how we can improve quality of life. Yes. And because none of us are getting any younger. I mean, who's going to get up? I mean, they have all these things like you go, it's a whole, you know, you're in this field like ways to p pull up socks when you can't bend down. How do you pull them up? I mean, there's all these physical needs that can be met by making all these physical devices like these. But now we have digital AI solutions that can help you communicate. Like you could say, "Hey, I need someone to put my socks on." So you could just click on socks and they'll come put your socks on.

Speaker 2: So interesting. As Sou grows, how do you think about innovation, product development, and growth without losing sight of the patient?

Speaker 1: As a business person, as an entrepreneur, I would like my solution to be used all the time, right? So one of the best one of the questions I get is like hey what if they start speaking and how will you make sure that they keep using so we have different ways of adding bells and whistles to the solution and we have stuff up our sleeves that I can't talk about but it is a way of making sure we retain the customer we keep the customer because the app becomes be becomes part of your life because it's on the phone it's not an extra advice. It just becomes part of your life. Like how many times do you check your um bank account every day or how many times do you go to WhatsApp or how many times do you I don't know all the different apps you use every day. I want it to be one of that background app that actually runs and you just use it for everything. You want to go to Netflix, you go through SOF, you click on the icon of Netflix in Sof because your eyes can't you can't speak. you use your so that's how I would want it to to be like I want it to be used like that and it it would grow with you because it we can add things to it like we can add AI voices to it we can add therapy to it the provider can download homework onto it they can have calendar on it so they one of the things that this speech language pathologist once told me that she visits visits her this child at home for therapy every two weeks and she gives homework on an iPad to the child and they put her put it in in her drawer every time she's she leaves and when she comes back 2 weeks later they take it out of the door in front of her no one looks at it for 2 weeks but if you have SOF the provider has the app in front of them they can check every day they can download homework it's just more interactive it's more it's basically what we do in school now. Like my daughter is taking my do daughter is a junior. She's got four AP classes. She's going crazy. And you see how they study now, how everything is monitored, how everything is that's that's how we we are that's how we are when we work. So why can't we be like that when we're older and retired?

Speaker 2: That's so true. And and because it's the other thing that you mentioned is it's good that there's not another device because you're right, we don't need additional devices. I the phone just rang and I looked at my watch. I mean, this is crazy, right? Like, I don't want that. So, we want it to be as because you want one thing that can control that that you have in front of you that you can just use as much as you can.

Speaker 1: What is the biggest mistake founders make when building in a regulated space like healthcare?

Speaker 2: not talking to enough people, not doing enough research, thinking you know, and especially I think it's it's easier to I mean a lot of people are like, "Oh, you're a scientist, so you must know." No, I don't. I study the human brain. It's the most complex organ in the body. It there's it's it's the entire universe. And the neuros neuroscientists are probably should be the most humble scientists in the world cuz we really don't understand it. And I think that if I had to go to other people to really understand business terms, really understand a lot of the uh clinical side of things cuz I'm a I can tell you about the human brain. But learning about the patient, the good thing about it is is that I didn't come to this from the neuroscience perspective. I came to it from a daughter's perspective. So I knew what the patient felt like and then I brought the neuroscience on top of it. So but I did meet a lot of clinicians. I met a lot of caregivers. I met I did as much interviews as possible to understand the need. So I think that is important to get that product to market fit is really important. That mold of breaking that first customer. We're trying to get customers right now. We're trying to raise money right now. And founders like myself, I'm the CEO. We are pulled in so many directions. And none of those things are easy. They're new. I mean, you're very very skilled and educated and knowledgeable in your but adding on. I mean, no one is good at everything. And you're so smart to keep questioning. You have to question. And right now, we're raising and that's another thing I wanted to say is we are crowdfunding at the moment for another two months. and we're doing it at Start Engine and you can probably uh tell people about it or have it in the podcast, but it's a great platform because it allows people to to follow us. It allows people to see how we're growing and it and for little money you can actually be part of the company in a small way to see how we can actually go to market and make revenue and it'll you'll be part of it. So, it's a really good way of being part of a commu because my company is a very commercial communal company and it's for the patient rather than something that is maybe just like hanging out with people in the market and more to towards business. I want it to be in the hands of the patients. What brings you the

Speaker 1: most joy in what you're doing today?

Speaker 2: Seeing people speak when they can't speak.

Speaker 1: Mhm. Has to be amazing. It's amazing. It

Speaker 2: It brings tears to my eyes because um I always say like have these billboards in SF when you're driving and there's all these AI billboards and all these product, you know, Salesforce and I want a a tiny billboard there or whatever and it says can't talk su that's it'll be there one day. It'll it will happen.

Speaker 1: I hope so. I really hope so. use

Speaker 2: neuroscience to to bring it to life.

Speaker 1: Yes. Thank you so much for joining us today. Please share with us again how and where we can find you and also share the link

Speaker 2: for the crowdfunding. My company is called Suf Solutions which is sofolutions sufolutions.com and you can also look for my name and it should come up Mahin Masu Adamson. And my apps are on uh basically all three apps. Suf solutions, SOF care uh caregiver and suf provider. All three of them are on Apple app store. We're also on Instagram. We are on Facebook. We're on LinkedIn.